politics & the office--just don't mix

[novapsyche]

So my boss is talking to our receptionist (who happens to be male) and strains of their conversation is wafting through the department. I hear:

"And he says that he believes that life begins at conception. Well, biologically, what else happens then?"

I say fairly audibly, "Now, see, that's something I think shouldn't be discussed in the office." But my boss's office is some cubes down, so he almost certainly didn't hear me (though my officemates did).

The receptionist: "Right."

My boss: "Now, he says life begins at conception, but he's for abortion."

I speak up quite loudly: "No, he's not 'for abortion,' he's for the right to choose. They're not necessarily the same thing."

Still don't think my boss heard me, though the rest of his conversation was difficult to discern.

It's difficult for me, as a woman who has had an abortion, to discuss it in the clinically dead tones one is supposed to when talking politics.

When I heard that Kerry said that he believed life began at conception, I was more than a little disappointed. But he regained his position in my sight when he said that he didn't believe in legislating his personal beliefs onto everyone else. That I can respect. That, to me, is the morally superior position.

Of course, as a woman and a feminist, I don't think men should have such power over such issues in the first place. I don't like being sexist, but this is one area where I cannot help but be.

Also, I'd like to add that I'm tired of abortions being women's dirty little secret. Several million women get abortions every year. Yet it's so rare to hear the procedure discussed among everyday people. I remember getting acquainted with my brother's fiance, and her relating to me her two abortions. We were not in earshot of anyone, but still she whispered the information to me.

The procedure is legal. It amazes me how stigmatized the women who get abortions are. I don't think rapists are so stigmatized (at least not date rapists).

Edit: This topic has been taken up in this thread in philosophy.

Comments

[prema.livejournal.com]

I don't think that it would be right to cut out men from having power in the issue. I am pro-choice but anti-abortion, and i believe one of the biggest hurdles in both camps is that having a baby is regarded as a mistake. It starts from having sex - and here's where i get prudish - why have sex if you're not ready to deal with consequences.

If a heterosexual couple have sex, and the woman gets pregnant - the first thing that they need to realise is that while it is the woman's body - it is also a result of the man's sperm as it is the egg. This makes it as much his responsibility as hers - and he is expected to have and show consideration that it is her body who is nourishing the fetus. Obviously most men don't do this, which is why alot of feminists want them cut out of the decision loop for an abortion. I think it is ethically wrong to remove the father from the decision.
Secondly, the woman should not be legally prevented from choosing to have an abortion. She should also not be prevented by the father if she chooses to, but he should be aware of her decision (because if it hadnt been for him, she wouldnt need to make that decision). And if she does choose to have the abortion - she should not fool herself into thinking that it was just a procedure for her convenience. I hate that we trivialise the fact that conception took place just to win a woman's right to choose. This is not even about moral obligations but simply that the fetus needs to be recognised as a central subject to the entire decision. The right to choose should have strong reasoning for it, but to me - the lines that we use today - "that it is the woman's body", or "it's not even alive" or "it's just a fetus" is ridiculous.

I don't have any good reasons - but having been placed in a situation where I had to make that choice, I know that it (the choice) needs to be available. The reasons behind it still needs to be worked on - they're far too weak. This is why the anti-choice camp will continue to be vocal and aggressive towards abortion.

[guttaperk.livejournal.com]

Unwanted, unwed pregnancy is excessively stigmatised, and abortion even more so, but in my view rape is rightly stigmatised to even a greater degree.

Even the refuted accusation of rape carries a terrible stigma.

[novapsyche.livejournal.com]

I should have qualified my statement: when I say "power", I mean legislative power. I agree with you on most of your statements. During my decision, my mate was there and was supportive and let me come to the ultimate decision. I definitely tried to take his concerns into account. But the feminist in me says that as it's ultimately my body that will be put into the most difficult situation (pregnancy and birth), the decision to carry the pregnancy to term should be mine.

There is a contingent of men--how large, I could not tell you--that wants a man to have veto power over the woman's right to choose. I cannot and will not agree to that and will fight that as strongly as I possibly can. That would effectively strip the woman of all personal power and choice and would relegate her back under the thumb of her current mate.

why have sex if you're not ready to deal with consequences.

Because it feels good. Forgive me for being so flippant, but seriously, this is why so many teenagers are having sex. Teenagers aren't giving much thought to the idea of having a child or, if they do, the idea is very romanticized. Teenagers in most cases are too young to stand trial as an adult--why should they be stuck with being a parent at such an age?

Now, for those my age, yeah, those defenses are gone. Still, accidents happen--condoms break, etc. One of my main reasons for having my abortion--that I was too poor to adequately raise a child--is still true. So if I were to become pregnant again, how would my decision change? Why should it change? (This is mostly devil's advocate, since I made a personal promise that I would keep my next pregnancy. Still, bringing a child up in poverty is pretty much damning that child to a life of poverty.)

[prema.livejournal.com]

Because it feels good.

yes it does :)
But the thing is, I find many women who are pro-choice dismiss the consequences as accidents, unexpected events in nature. Oh it was an accident? Well no it isn't - every contraceptive product out there comes with its set of statistics to say that it is entirely possible to still have a baby despite the best laid plans. We're talking bout consensual sex here of course.

A pregnancy should never be called an accident - its just our bodies doing exactly what its supposed to do. I also feel strongly that the vast majority of decisions made to have an abortion is because of the weak social structure in place to help women raise children either as a single mother, or in circumstances they deemed as.. "wrong". Not to mention the instances where the woman is not in a steady relationship or marriage. Part of the prochoice campaign should also move to help provide for women who choose NOT to have an abortion - they're not doing that. My decision was influenced greatly by my society, my family's ultra-conservative and admittedly, my own feelings that I am not in the right "place" in my life to raise a child. It is my only regret - and while I realise that I am being selfish to want to have other things in life rather than face the responsibility of child-rearing, i also know that had I had that child - I would be in unimaginable domestic-social chaos. :-\

It's just a really really complex issue. I certainly don;t agree with all-male legislators trying to decide what we choose to do. But if it happens to be a team of all-male legislators who are sympathetic to pro-choice principles, then I don't we would be complaining either. It's just a matter of getting the right people in office rather than the right gender (this is another hot spot with me and feminism :)

[novapsyche.livejournal.com]

A pregnancy should never be called an accident - its just our bodies doing exactly what its supposed to do.

This sounds like a catch phrase. I do think some pregnancies can be termed accidents, especially if you've done all that you can to make sure that it doesn't occur.

I was an accident. Of course, my mom calls me her "surprise".

It's just a matter of getting the right people in office rather than the right gender (this is another hot spot with me and feminism :)

Don't get me wrong--I know full well that there are male feminists out there. (My Feminist Philosophy course was taught by a man, a very thoughtful man who I would definitely consider a feminist.) In general, though, men pick up feminist ideals secondhand, and there's often some resistance. In a male-dominated society, it's easier for a man to stay situated in his own realm of perception.